Fried chip?

Page 1 of 2 1, 2  Next

View previous topic View next topic Go down

Fried chip?

Post by Yellowghost on Tue Jan 12, 2016 7:08 pm



Switched to LEds and think I screwed something up in the process. Many switches are not registering. I researched on the interweb and found theres a few tests I can do. Goto switch levels in menu and while testing, pull the connectors off the board. If it goes away, it is a wire or socket touching something else..and if it doesnt it means a chip is fried. There is another test which I dont understand is to test switch matrix pins for ground. Can this be done with a multimeter that doesnt have continueity?

Yellowghost

Posts : 212
Join date : 2012-11-29

Back to top Go down

Re: Fried chip?

Post by Malibu-ss on Tue Jan 12, 2016 8:28 pm

you have a light socket touching something?

_________________
http://www.pinballowners.com/malibu%20ss
avatar
Malibu-ss
Admin

Posts : 1533
Join date : 2011-09-29
Location : Winnipeg

Back to top Go down

Re: Fried chip?

Post by Yellowghost on Tue Jan 12, 2016 11:02 pm

I DID. A few of them. I moved them out of the way. Error message went away. All switches register in the switch test now. But all selonoids are dead even in test mode.Fuse f112 was blown. Put a new one in and it blew instantly on powerup. So tommorow I will check the solenoids wirings again for anything touching. But I read theres a number of things that could have caused this.

Yellowghost

Posts : 212
Join date : 2012-11-29

Back to top Go down

Re: Fried chip?

Post by Yellowghost on Thu Jan 14, 2016 6:03 pm

Ok , so I checked all the coils for resistance and they all are close to what they should be. Not sure about about "a-14701". Its not on the resistance chart I found on the interweb. Got a reading of 181-ish. Would I be correct to assume that the coils are good? Next up is to unsolder all the diodes and check those too.

Yellowghost

Posts : 212
Join date : 2012-11-29

Back to top Go down

Re: Fried chip?

Post by Grevier2 on Thu Jan 14, 2016 7:04 pm

Wow Jeff sucks to be you.. I hope you figure everything out! It will be a learning experience that's for sure. Also scares the crap out of me for when I finally change my HH lights to LED.
avatar
Grevier2

Posts : 220
Join date : 2015-08-10
Age : 30
Location : Elmwood

Back to top Go down

Re: Fried chip?

Post by Yellowghost on Thu Jan 14, 2016 9:28 pm

Dont be stupid like me. Shut it down first and you won't have a problem I think

Yellowghost

Posts : 212
Join date : 2012-11-29

Back to top Go down

Re: Fried chip?

Post by prock on Fri Jan 15, 2016 10:41 am

f112 will blow on a shorted flash lamp socket (did you check these?) or a shorted coil or if BR3 or BR4 is bad on the power driver board. Sounds like the coils are all good (you didn't get 0 resistance). I'm assuming the flashers aren't working either. Also if there are any special relays or motors on the game they may cause this as well (try unplugging them to see if the fuse blows.. hope you have lots extra). There are ways to test the bridge rectifiers (BR3 and BR4 ) on the driver board either in the game or out.. I would probably suggest you take the driver board out to test them.
avatar
prock

Posts : 720
Join date : 2012-06-30
Location : Winnipeg

Back to top Go down

Re: Fried chip?

Post by prock on Fri Jan 15, 2016 11:56 am

oh and yes... ALWAYS shut the game off when working on it. I've had games where I was able to change lights, move the playfield up while it's on... etc etc and nothing bad happens. I've had other games where if I lift the playfield I had a small chance of shorting the IR LED driver board out, it didn't happen all the time but it did happen. I could never track down the source of the problem so I got in the habit of always working on games with the power off.
avatar
prock

Posts : 720
Join date : 2012-06-30
Location : Winnipeg

Back to top Go down

Re: Fried chip?

Post by Yellowghost on Fri Jan 15, 2016 12:39 pm

Procks. Tha ks. I have read to try disconnecting some connectors from the driverboards. Then power it up with a new fuse. If the fuse doesn't blow on startup, it means the problem is something in a coil or socket. IF it blows with nothing connected then in means its something on the board. But what connecters do I unplug? J129 and J130 I think? The ones that power the coils.

Yellowghost

Posts : 212
Join date : 2012-11-29

Back to top Go down

Re: Fried chip?

Post by prock on Fri Jan 15, 2016 12:43 pm

Yeah... unplug connectors for both coils and flashlamps. I don't know what connectors those are without looking at some schematics. If they continue to blow I'd imagine it's one of the bridge rectifiers.
avatar
prock

Posts : 720
Join date : 2012-06-30
Location : Winnipeg

Back to top Go down

Re: Fried chip?

Post by Yellowghost on Fri Jan 15, 2016 4:15 pm

Awesome Prock. Flashers are all working. IN THE manual in the solenoid table, its says j130 for the high-powers and j127 for low-power. At this point, I'd almost rather be a board problem. Taking out all those diodes and resoldering them clearly is daunting tasks.
Thanks again.

Yellowghost

Posts : 212
Join date : 2012-11-29

Back to top Go down

Re: Fried chip?

Post by Freezie on Sat Jan 16, 2016 9:02 pm

It's almost a rite of passage yellowghost. It sucks , but it's sooooo gratifying when you finally find that problem and fix it yourself .
avatar
Freezie

Posts : 293
Join date : 2013-04-21

Back to top Go down

Re: Fried chip?

Post by prock on Sun Jan 17, 2016 12:00 pm

I have a single BR here if you have one that tests bad.. it's a bit over spec (35A, 400V) but it's not an issue.   You can get the exact spec ones (35A, 200V) at digikey for about $4 CAD each..  https://www.digikey.ca/product-detail/en/GBPC3502W/GBPC3502WFS-ND/1057470
avatar
prock

Posts : 720
Join date : 2012-06-30
Location : Winnipeg

Back to top Go down

Re: Fried chip?

Post by Yellowghost on Sun Jan 17, 2016 4:13 pm

Hope so fteezie. Thanks. And thanks also to you Prock. I tested all the bridge rectifiers but BR1 is the one with a bad reading. So that will need to be changed but its on different circuit than where my problem is. Checked once again under the playfield and no other metal is touching any of the coil lugs except the wures soldered to them. Flasher sockets look good too.

Yellowghost

Posts : 212
Join date : 2012-11-29

Back to top Go down

Re: Fried chip?

Post by prock on Thu Jan 21, 2016 11:11 pm

Any luck yellowghost?  It just so happens I'm working on a WCS94 with a bad BR1 as well... It has a bunch of other problems though which I'll work on after I get the BR1 issues worked out. I'm hoping those issues might go away after I get a proper +18VDC on TP8 and a steady +12VDC on TP3.
avatar
prock

Posts : 720
Join date : 2012-06-30
Location : Winnipeg

Back to top Go down

Re: Fried chip?

Post by Yellowghost on Fri Jan 22, 2016 6:02 pm

Good luck Prock. Bit of a standstill right now. My BR's test good except for BR4. I still trying to get a grasp on reading diagrams. But I've been playing with the multimeter and have so far figured out that power comes into the drvr board thru the j102 connector, branches off into connectors j104 and j105 either before or after power passes thru fuse f112. J104 goes to another small board and then to the beacon, which has been removed for a long time now. J105 goes to the flipper board. After the fuse , power goes thru BR3, which tests good. Then branches off to a capacitor "c8" and "Tp3" which I havent a clue what it is. Then branches off again into an entire bank of fuses and connectors J107,108 and 109. Basically, this weekend is only to remove the flipper solenoids and check diodes. Capacitors can't be tested. Anyways..I don't know what the proper rating is for fuse 112 is yet. Need somebody with a working getaway to check theirs and see.

Yellowghost

Posts : 212
Join date : 2012-11-29

Back to top Go down

Re: Fried chip?

Post by prock on Wed Jan 27, 2016 11:43 am

Could potentially be that C8 is now shorted.  When you say TP3 I think you mean TP6 which should read around 75VDC I think when the machine is running and the fuse isn't blowing.. perhaps someone can confirm this number.  I know you don't have a lot of fuses but have you tried removing J104, J105, J107 and J108 to eliminate a short in the beacon, coils, or flipper boards?  Are there any other fuses blown (specifically F101-F105)?  

Also, what are you voltages on the other test points?  You should get something like:

tp1 - 13.9V
tp2 - 5V
tp3 - 12V
tp6 - ~75V (you'll get 0V here as the fuse is blown)
tp7 - 22V (if BR4 is bad you should have nothing here but I would expect your flashers not to work)
tp8 - ~18V

And the LEDs are lit as follows:
1 - lit
2 - lit
3 - pulses
4 - lit
5 - lit
6 - lit
7 - lit

F112 should be a 7A Slow Blow.


Last edited by prock on Wed Jan 27, 2016 1:50 pm; edited 1 time in total
avatar
prock

Posts : 720
Join date : 2012-06-30
Location : Winnipeg

Back to top Go down

Re: Fried chip?

Post by prock on Wed Jan 27, 2016 11:45 am

All the fuse values for future reference.

Power Driver Board
F1O1 Left Flipper. 3A. S.B. Not Used
F1O2 Right Flipper. 3A, S.B. Not Used
F1O3 Solenoid #25-#28. 3A. S.B.
F104 Solenoid #9-#16. 3A. S.B.
F1O5 Solenoid #1-#8. 3A. S.B.
F1O6 G.I. #5 Wht-Vio. 5A. S.B.
F1O7 G.!. #4 Wht-Gm. 5A. S.B.
F108 G.!. #3 Wht-Yel. SA, S.B.
F1O9 G.!. #2 Wht-Org. 5A, S.B.
F11O G.I. #1 Wht-Bm. SA, S.B.
F111 Flasher Secondary. 5A. S.B.
F112 Solenoid Secondary. 7A, S.B.
F113 +5V Logic. 5A, S.B.
F114 +18V Lamp Matrix. 8A. N.B.
F115 +12V Switch Matrix. 3/4A, S.B.
F116 +12V Secondary. 3A, S.B.


Last edited by prock on Wed Jan 27, 2016 1:51 pm; edited 1 time in total
avatar
prock

Posts : 720
Join date : 2012-06-30
Location : Winnipeg

Back to top Go down

Re: Fried chip?

Post by Malibu-ss on Wed Jan 27, 2016 1:14 pm

F112 Solenoid Secondary. 5A, S.B. is wrong in the book.
On the machine it says 7 amp S.B. and that is what is my getaway

_________________
http://www.pinballowners.com/malibu%20ss
avatar
Malibu-ss
Admin

Posts : 1533
Join date : 2011-09-29
Location : Winnipeg

Back to top Go down

Re: Fried chip?

Post by prock on Wed Jan 27, 2016 1:51 pm

Thanks for the clarification Malibu! I've updated my posts to avoid confusion.
avatar
prock

Posts : 720
Join date : 2012-06-30
Location : Winnipeg

Back to top Go down

Re: Fried chip?

Post by Yellowghost on Wed Jan 27, 2016 9:17 pm

Thanks Prock. Thats the kind of information that will come in handy.Still nothing doing. Rebuilt the flippers and checked the diodes at the same time and they are fine. Plan of attack is to put the board back in and reboot WHEN I can find the right fuse. Its pretty sad that theres only one electronics supply store in town. Anyway ...and when I get to that ponit, I will check the voltages. I assume you touch the red prong the lug and black to a ground? And what DC setting do I turn my multimeter too? Theres 5 to choose from?

Yellowghost

Posts : 212
Join date : 2012-11-29

Back to top Go down

Re: Fried chip?

Post by prock on Thu Jan 28, 2016 9:24 am

You probably wont find any fuses locally.. I've been trying to find a source and have yet to do so. I have some 7A and 5A fuses I got from pinballlife you can have. As far as testing voltages just be very very careful. Some meters have multiple spots to plug the leads so be sure you plug them into the right spot. What I would do BEFORE you test anything on your pin is to test a AA battery or something to be sure it reads properly. I would set the voltmeter to DC somewhere in the range of the voltage you will be measuring. For example I set mine to the 200VDC mark which gives me readings from 0-200VDC. All voltmeters are different but there should be a setting which will work.

Also BE VERY CAREFUL not to short anything out while the game is on (probably obvious but I cannot stress this enough). Place the black lead onto the ground braid located near or on the bottom of the inside of the head. Then you touch the red lead to the test points. Again be very careful not to slip and short something out. Really it's not that bad... just have to be careful. It's like taking the glass out for the first time (and every time after that I suppose)... take your time.

avatar
prock

Posts : 720
Join date : 2012-06-30
Location : Winnipeg

Back to top Go down

Re: Fried chip?

Post by Yellowghost on Thu Jan 28, 2016 9:57 am

Awesome Prock!! I just might take you up on the 7amp fuse. Even just one until somebody places a order for stuff.. I have 5amp fuses. Aactive actually stocks those. Wouldnt that be something if it works fine with the 7 amp huh?

Yellowghost

Posts : 212
Join date : 2012-11-29

Back to top Go down

Re: Fried chip?

Post by Malibu-ss on Thu Jan 28, 2016 12:51 pm

you can order fuses from here.............shipping is cheap

https://www.greatplainselectronics.com/categories.asp?cat=13

_________________
http://www.pinballowners.com/malibu%20ss
avatar
Malibu-ss
Admin

Posts : 1533
Join date : 2011-09-29
Location : Winnipeg

Back to top Go down

Re: Fried chip?

Post by prock on Thu Jan 28, 2016 1:22 pm

Yeah I've ordered from them...   probably the best place to order from right now.


Digikey also stocks the 7A SB ones for 54 cents CAD each: http://www.digikey.ca/product-detail/en/3SB%207-R/507-1534-ND/1009741

I haven't ordered fuses from Digikey yet but it should work (my disclaimer).

For reference:

5A SB: http://www.digikey.ca/scripts/DkSearch/dksus.dll?Detail&itemSeq=188735565&uq=635895840168959370

3A SB: http://www.digikey.ca/scripts/DkSearch/dksus.dll?Detail&itemSeq=188735727&uq=635895838256918185
avatar
prock

Posts : 720
Join date : 2012-06-30
Location : Winnipeg

Back to top Go down

Re: Fried chip?

Post by Sponsored content


Sponsored content


Back to top Go down

Page 1 of 2 1, 2  Next

View previous topic View next topic Back to top

- Similar topics

 
Permissions in this forum:
You cannot reply to topics in this forum